tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post1832745791185433852..comments2024-03-29T10:12:07.396-04:00Comments on Vital Remnants: Arguing in the Void: What's wrong with Coyne and Carroll's arguments against the immortality of the soulMartin Cothranhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16452612266051351726noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-7659021026605743922011-06-11T08:40:50.806-04:002011-06-11T08:40:50.806-04:00Thanks Thomas, I appreciate your effort to advance...Thanks Thomas, I appreciate your effort to advance a positive description of 'souls' and I am glad you acknowledge that many Christians give quite different meanings to the term, which is one of the reasons I asked for a definition - we have to know what we are talking about before we can talk about it.<br /><br />Now as to the substance of your post:<br /><br />'The soul is what we Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-89285359477268391632011-06-09T20:05:32.266-04:002011-06-09T20:05:32.266-04:00Singring,
If you're asking what people mean w...Singring,<br /><br />If you're asking what people mean when they talk about the soul, you're going to get different answers. But you seem to be under the impression that Christians generally believe in the soul as something other than a physical principle or activity; something like the Platonic soul that always did exist and always will exist, that is by nature eternal. This view of the Thomas M. Cothranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07824873424225826685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-48228453794991184012011-06-07T14:33:49.702-04:002011-06-07T14:33:49.702-04:00'Are you trying to misinterpret me in the othe...'Are you trying to misinterpret me in the other direction in order to make up for your original misinterpretation?'<br /><br />No. You protested that I was misrepresenting your views on the objective existence of particles and so I asked you directly to clarify your position and correct me if I was wrong.<br /><br />You apparently are refusing to do so by going back to your perennial and Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-34679362149257471452011-06-07T14:05:04.586-04:002011-06-07T14:05:04.586-04:00Singring,
Are you trying to misinterpret me in th...Singring,<br /><br />Are you trying to misinterpret me in the other direction in order to make up for your original misinterpretation?Martin Cothranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16452612266051351726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-1157181360214094252011-06-07T03:21:18.744-04:002011-06-07T03:21:18.744-04:00''Where did I say I believed these things?...''Where did I say I believed these things?'<br /><br />Are you now saying that you believe that particles like electrons or photons have an objective physical reality?Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-70618954048600781882011-06-07T03:20:21.755-04:002011-06-07T03:20:21.755-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-76255114384728192112011-06-06T21:22:36.256-04:002011-06-06T21:22:36.256-04:00Singring,
On the same thread you accused me of mi...Singring,<br /><br />On the same thread you accused me of misrepresenting your opinion (which I didn't) You misrepresented the question Anonymous asked and now you misrepresent me. <br /><br />You attribute to me all the views I quoted quantum physicists saying. Where did I say I believed these things?Martin Cothranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16452612266051351726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-45748627558796087852011-06-06T19:49:25.386-04:002011-06-06T19:49:25.386-04:00Martin, I was browsing through my 'Quantum The...Martin, I was browsing through my 'Quantum Theory a very short introduction' by Polkinghorn and I will wager a guess that this has been your primary source for your quotes by Bohr and Heisenberg. Interestigly,you do not cite the author's esponse to the Heisenberg quote: <br /><br />'I would disagree with Heisenberg in thinking that this fact makes an electron 'ot as real' Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-81751257983673219472011-06-06T16:28:44.295-04:002011-06-06T16:28:44.295-04:00On a more general note:
Have you noticed that you...On a more general note:<br /><br />Have you noticed that you are now actually arguing for exactly the position you previously told Peter (I think that was his name) was false?<br /><br />AS far as I can tell, you are now saying that you think that particles are not real - i.e. that they have no objective reality. Yet we can still do experiments on them - we can test the effects they have on Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-65678609807503445602011-06-06T15:58:14.152-04:002011-06-06T15:58:14.152-04:00'You say things like this as if you are comple...'You say things like this as if you are completely unaware of the Copenhagen Interpretation of quantum theory, arguably the dominant one in the field.'<br /><br />No, Martin, I do not. Just because the definition of an electron incorporates the fact that it behaves like a particle in some situations and like a wave in others does not mean I don't have a definition of what an electron Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-12646597794583433642011-06-06T15:01:47.490-04:002011-06-06T15:01:47.490-04:00Singring,
I do have testifyable, empirical eviden...Singring,<br /><br /><i>I do have testifyable, empirical evidence to support my beliefs in what DNA is and what an electron or a proton is and what they do.</i><br /><br />You say things like this as if you are completely unaware of the Copenhagen Interpretation of quantum theory, arguably the dominant one in the field.<br /><br />You constantly equate descriptive and predictive power with Martin Cothranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16452612266051351726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-83463492640969818682011-06-06T13:47:38.235-04:002011-06-06T13:47:38.235-04:00'Why do you have one standard for belief in th...'Why do you have one standard for belief in the soul and an entirely different (and apparently lower) standard for your scientific beliefs?'<br /><br />Martin, you once again have completely misrepresented what I have said and the entire question in general. <br /><br />I do have testifyable, empirical evidence to support my beliefs in what DNA is and what an electron or a proton is and Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-59679502098101526232011-06-06T13:01:30.987-04:002011-06-06T13:01:30.987-04:00ANDREW: "Describe matter distinctly Singring,...ANDREW: "Describe matter distinctly Singring, that stuff that DNA is made of, including its origins."<br /><br />SINGRING: I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'distinctly'. Matter as we knew it and define it originated at the big bang. I don't know how the Big Bang happened and I never claimed I do.<br /><br />Singring, I think what Andrew is getting at is that you Martin Cothranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16452612266051351726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-30545261345205172852011-06-06T07:38:58.991-04:002011-06-06T07:38:58.991-04:00'Do you believe that we have a will that is no...'Do you believe that we have a will that is not entirely explained by matter and energy? (i.e. cannot be reduced to appetites/stimulus-response or other material explanations)'<br /><br />No.Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-7230257540150530812011-06-06T07:38:18.639-04:002011-06-06T07:38:18.639-04:00'Describe matter distinctly Singring, that stu...'Describe matter distinctly Singring, that stuff that DNA is made of, including its origins.'<br /><br />I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'distinctly'. Matter as we knew it and define it originated at the big bang. I don't know how the Big Bang happened and I never claimed I do.<br /><br />But how exactly does that show that philosophy or theology has an answer to that Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-88516371187218082132011-06-06T00:46:44.110-04:002011-06-06T00:46:44.110-04:00Singring
Do you believe that we have a will that ...Singring<br /><br />Do you believe that we have a will that is not entirely explained by matter and energy? (i.e. cannot be reduced to appetites/stimulus-response or other material explanations)Andrewnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-16102644670575207042011-06-05T02:32:41.352-04:002011-06-05T02:32:41.352-04:00We may know something with certainty but indistinc...We may know something with certainty but indistinctly. We know for certain things change but what is change? <br /><br />Describe matter distinctly Singring, that stuff that DNA is made of, including its origins.Dr. George Whitesides of Harvard University, who has the highest Hirsch-index rating of any living chemist said, “The origin of life is a total mystery.” <br /><br />Explain how an Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11542449.post-79359814115302790312011-06-02T04:16:51.883-04:002011-06-02T04:16:51.883-04:00'This is a consistent problem with the New Ath...'This is a consistent problem with the New Atheists: they just simply ignore the best arguments against their positions and instead either cherry pick the worst arguments or simply make stuff up.'<br /><br />It strikes me as very odd that you continually assert that there are 'best arguments' about souls and list philosopher after philosopher who apparently has given rock-solid Singringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180277470418724600noreply@blogger.com